the dude3/18/2017 9:19:52 PM
A Kethan Savage steal and 2 FTs seals a Sweet 16 trip for Butler and Kethan. Congrats to Kethan.
Now go shock the world and take down UNC!
thinker3/18/2017 11:50:27 PM
Events of the last year have caused me to alter my view on Savage's tenure at GW. He was never happy at GW and now I have more context on why that may have been.
It's great for him to be ending his college career on an NCAA run. Congrats Kethan!
the dude3/19/2017 12:09:30 AM
Well said Thinker.
lt3/19/2017 12:17:26 AM
Congratulations Kethan and good luck in your next game. Agree with Thinker on better understanding the factors that prompted his transfer and perhaps Jorgensen's. Really like the chemistry and mindset of this Butler team. How ironic is that Butler has outlasted Villanova this season!
wax daddy3/19/2017 1:41:26 AM
Classy everyone, congrats Kethan and happy that we have someone from gw to watch still in the tourney!
nj colonial3/19/2017 2:07:21 AM
You guys are more gracious fans than I am... I wish Kethan the best but he left GW, so as a fan, I left him.
bo knows3/19/2017 9:35:30 AM
Fact of the matter is Kethan would no longer be playing for GW had he stayed having used his eligibility. That said good to see him advance to Sweet 16.
Now back to your regularly scheduled conjecture diatribe against ML. The fact was that Kethan didn't like how ML used him on the court and ML wasn't acceding to his demands to have a certain role among other things. Both parties confirmed this at the time not only to me but publicly. That was the reason. Not anything esle that otherwise subsequently happened. To my understanding, most of what was alleged against ML as the basis for his dismissal was alleged to occur after Kethan left.
We've now come to the point where anything negative that happened over the past 5 years will be laid at ML's doorstep. That is naive, wrongheaded and sometimes downright laughable.
ruserious3/19/2017 9:53:10 AM
yes Bo Knows, you're quite the "insider".
Do you honestly think Kethan would badmouth ML publically or to someone he barely knows? (you).
bo knows3/19/2017 9:57:50 AM
Sorry RUSerious, I know both his high school coach and his AAU coach. You will simply have to try harder next time.
bo knows3/19/2017 10:01:00 AM
Sorry, that should have said "I also know"
yawle3/19/2017 11:18:05 AM
back to back steals and lay ups second half vs. Wichita State in Hawaii turned that game for GW and were a majpr part of Diamondhead Classic title
jammer3/19/2017 12:13:03 PM
Just type of player we need. Piles up boards steals attacks rim gets to the line.
boom3/19/2017 12:19:24 PM
Lol Bo is so full of it. One deception after another. Good luck Kethan.
bobo3/19/2017 1:45:51 PM
In fairness, Jammer, Savage averaged 2.7 rebounds and 0.9 steals per game for Butler. He was more active his sophmore season at GW.
the dude3/19/2017 2:22:03 PM
Per 40 nearly identical, and did it in the Big East. Most importantly, Turnovers down, even though he had the ball on every possession this year for Butler playing the point.
188.8.131.52/19/2017 3:57:06 PM
Why is that "ironic" LT? Butler beat Villanova twice this season
lt3/19/2017 4:01:39 PM
184.108.40.206- I was kidding. I know that Butler beat Villanova both times they played.
bigfan3/19/2017 4:27:54 PM
In actual minutes played, Kethan playing 20 minutes a game for Butler rather than 30 for us.
He is clearly not their starting point guard option, having started only 10 games, according to Butler web site. 1.5 assists.
This is after a year to recover from injury, where at GW he was never the same, and a system that he might have fit in better.
Glad Kethan, like Lasan, is enoying NCAA glory as a supersub, but sub nonetheless. Did he accept that role here?
Whatever the dynamics of the situation, personally knew when Kethan stopped starting, he was gone. Personally, would have started him just for that, but at GW, Kethan had an ego.
Always thought Kethan could have accomplished more at GW, but didn't always bring his A game.
He was a me first player for us, though don t necessarily think that was selfishness some thought, just wanting to be the hero.
Who didn't cringe when we gave Kethan the ball in the waning seconds of a game? It did not usually end well.
At Butler, like Lasan at UConn., he seems to have accepted his role. That's the difference.
Doubt Kethan dreamed of averaging. 8 points a game, largely off the bench, in his last college season. Think he dreamed of glory.
But he can try his professional prospects here and overseas. And he seemed fine and polite off the court. There is more to life than basketball.
Glad Kethan is accepting his role at Butler, at a higher leven and in the NCAA, but diminished from his minutes and averages at GW.
The key is accepting his role. That's a sign of maturity and the most important thing for an impending or recent college graduate.
the dude3/19/2017 6:05:13 PM
Kethan is the starting point guard, for a team in the Sweet 16, for a Coach he loves to play for.
You can hang onto old, false narratives, and write new ones about Kethan, but they are as wrong today as they were a few years ago, and they continue to do him a real disservice here.
Keep on winning Kethan!!
ziik the peasant3/19/2017 6:08:35 PM
So, are we still presuming KS comes here, breathlessly, every day, to see what his old fans are saying?
I guess I will never know this new way of communication
maine colonial3/19/2017 6:20:13 PM
Kethan has started the last 10 games for Butler and he will start the next one too. With all the DMV teams out of the tournament, I would be surprised if the Post doesn't have a feature on Kethan because he's a DMV kid who played for our DMV university for three seasons and had to miss GW's NCAA tournament game in 2014 due to injury. So after overcoming injuries, pneumonia and our former head coach, he is realizing his dream of being a starting point guard in the NCAA Tournament. We sure could have used his defense last year when we couldn't stop dribble penetration and had to settle for playing in the NIT. I imagine he had a couple heated conversations with our previous head coach that were similar to these two: SCENE1 SCENE2
I hate the Big East so I can't root for Butler but I can't root against Kethan either. And if I were a betting man, I would bet we're going to see Paulie play in the NCAA Tournament next season.
the dude3/19/2017 6:21:22 PM
He has started the last 10 games including both NCAA tourney wins, and has basically played started minutes all year since recovering from illness. Butler is a very deep team that brings their start (Kelan Martin) off the bench and rotates heavily.
KETHAN GAME LOG
the mv3/19/2017 6:49:09 PM
I would be happy for Kethan if I felt this is what he ideally wanted. Sure, he must be happy playing in the NCAA's and reaching the Sweet 16; who wouldn't be? However, I think he envisioned having the chance to convince pro scouts that he is an NBA caliber point guard. Or, professional caliber at the least. Do you think he has achieved this? He did come off the bench for much of the season, and has clearly played both guard positions this season depending on who else is in the game. He has done well and this post is not at all to suggest that he hasn't. But, has he accomplished the personal goals he set for himself when he stated his reason for leaving GW? Not very convincingly if at all.
jfw3/19/2017 6:53:18 PM
ML fired for abusing players. Was hardest on Savage. No mystery why he transferred
bobo3/19/2017 7:05:28 PM
Wouldn't be holding my breath waiting for that Washington Post article on Kethan Savage leading the Butler Bulldogs to NCAA glory.
maine colonial3/19/2017 7:16:09 PM
You're probably right given that ML has friends in low and/or high places. And what a sad commentary on the Post because it's a good story even though GW wouldn't come across in the best possible light. But I would love to know what Kethan thinks of MoJo as GW's new head coach.
gyph3/19/2017 9:08:08 PM
Good points for the Dude, insane paranoid commentary from BigFan and the MV, as per usual.
Lonergan couldn't find space for him in his precious system, so ran everyone into the group physically and emotionally last year; the kid overcame a bad, bad illness for months, and is now in the Sweet 16.
When McDonald's hips were acting up so much last year, thank GOD Lonergan just couldn't find room for Savage.
gyph3/19/2017 9:10:50 PM
"Now back to your regularly scheduled conjecture diatribe against ML. The fact was that Kethan didn't like how ML used him on the court and ML wasn't acceding to his demands to have a certain role among other things. Both parties confirmed this at the time not only to me but publicly. That was the reason. Not anything esle that otherwise subsequently happened. To my understanding, most of what was alleged against ML as the basis for his dismissal was alleged to occur after Kethan left.
We've now come to the point where anything negative that happened over the past 5 years will be laid at ML's doorstep. That is naive, wrongheaded and sometimes downright laughable."
He blew a 16 point lead to St. Joseph's in the A10 quarterfinals the year Savage would have been a senior, because he was so deeply arrogant he didn't see a need for him in his system.
That's Mike Lonergan's fault, yeah.
hippo man3/19/2017 10:48:15 PM
So funny that we can't say Lonergan would have won more games than Mojo with this team because that is speculation. But we know exactly what would have happened if Savage had stayed. The poster with the many names is simply full of shit.
gyph3/19/2017 10:53:17 PM
You can say whatever you want; without a foundation from which to make inferences, you just sound like an idiot.
Whereas the team absolutely could have used a poised guard last year. Which proceeds to take the heat off Jorgensen, etc.
We're, of course, not allowed to say Mike Lonergan treated his players terribly in spite of a Washington Post longform piece, two internal investigations and one external one all coming to that conclusion. Nor are we allowed to say that perhaps -- just perhaps -- this had an impact on things the last two years.
hippo man3/20/2017 8:04:55 AM
Unless you have specific evidence to refute what Bo says above, GYHP you should close your pie hole. Any fifth rate lawyer knows you can't say that because someone committed a robbery once that they committed another specific robbery without any direct evidence. It is exactly what Bo says above - using your general dislike for Lonergan to ascribe everything and anything to him without any evidence. He may have his faults like almost any of us but is nowhere near the monster you would like him to be.
long suffering fan3/20/2017 8:16:31 AM
Why do I get this feeling that this thread is nothing more than yet another ad nauseum attack on Mike Lonergan than sincere good wishes for a former player?
maine colonial3/20/2017 8:28:34 AM
There is definite evidence ML had issues:
--3 GW players transferred each year for the last four years, which is evidence of poor recruiting and/or conflicts with his players.
--Some of those players were very talented and went on to play for higher-level NCAA Tournament teams: Kromah; Pellom; and Savage. Will Paulie be next?
--Your job as a coach is to utilize the talent you have and tweak your "system" as necessary to maximize wins and get to the NCAA Tournament. Kethan wasn't asking to play center. He was asking to play point guard, which was not too unreasonable given that last year ML had to rely on Paulie and Alex in that role for significant minutes and Butler is using him that way now.
--ML clearly couldn't get along with his superior.
--He got fired for cause.
maine colonial3/20/2017 8:33:50 AM
So I would surmise most GW basketball fans wish Kethan had stayed with the program but understand why he left and wish him well even though he plays for a Big East team that used the A10 as a stepping stone.
gyhp3/20/2017 9:27:56 AM
I actually didn't dispute anything Bo said about why Savage left. I simply pointed out that that still makes Mike Lonergan an arrogant fool. Considering the slating that kid has taken on this board for what both parties claimed was basically an amciable parting (about which he's been proven right twice over), go Kethan.
long suffering fan3/20/2017 9:29:52 AM
FWIW. I spoke with someone close to Kethan's family (a lawyer colleague of mine) who indicated that Kethan really did leave because he wanted to play point and not due to issues with the coach.
the mv3/20/2017 9:58:09 AM
We shot the lights out from 3 in that first half against St. Joe's in building a 16 point lead. Kethan is about a 30% career shooter from 3. Not only do we have no idea whether Kethan's presence in that game would have enabled GW to protect that lead, but we also don't know whether we would have built up a 16 point lead to begin with. What a stupid exercise, projecting what might have been in a particular game if a player who had transferred out hadn't. The whole game could have gone differently in any direction. Just a ridiculous supposition.
bobo3/20/2017 10:01:33 AM
Coaches have to have the authority to chose the positions for the players. Anybody that's ever coached has experienced occurances when either players or their parents want to play a different positon or get more playing time. But the coach decides. Players are free to leave and play elsewhere if the coach doesn't grant their wishes but it always has to be up to the coaching staff to try to put who they think are the best players at each position.
Savage averaged 1.5 assists/game this year at Butler. He's got a good handle but I don't see him as a PG either. He is good at getting into the lane for short jumpers or getting to the line. Do you make him the PG at GW last year above Joe McDonald? Sometimes they switched duties and often Savage had the ball in his hands for late in clock or game situations. But that wasn't enough for Kethan and he wanted to run the show for a team. That's fine but we can't be requiring coaches to stop making basketball decisions based on who they think is best for each position.
fly on the wall3/20/2017 10:12:31 AM
Happy for him and hope his success continues. And I agree with Bobo..sorry it didn't work out but glad he made the move best for him although I certainly missed him.
Was surprised but glad that I thought I saw him as part of a player montage on a marketing ad at the start of the tourney--not sure whether it was CBS or NCAA. Players from a number of teams provided quick quips on the meaning of the tournament and I thought it great that a senior who transferred and earned an opportunity to play in 1 ncaa was part of the montage.
butler fan3/20/2017 11:28:22 AM
Despite all the bull crap said about the Kethan-ML relationship, the truth is that it was more of the GW system versus ML's personality that was an issue. These players come from AAU programs that make ML seem like a pussy cat comparatively. AAU Coaches cuss kids outs on a regular. Big deal. For Kethan it was strictly busisness not personal. So all of the story spins can keep on spinning.
gyph3/20/2017 11:48:32 AM
Do they also have coaches that routinely accuse players of sleeping with older men in positions of authority, repeatedly? Let me know. The answer may even be yes! Since THAT's why Mike Lonergan is fired, and THAT's the story that his supporters perpetuate, and THAT's the theory illustrious longtime posters like The MV and Big Fan think has merit.
bo knows3/20/2017 1:04:08 PM
So it turns out I am not so full of it as LSF and others have confirmed lol. Not that I didn't know that before.
Again, I don't have a problem with anyone believing Kethan Savage should have finished his career at GW. But ML didn't drive him out. He just wasn't going to change his style of play to cater to Kethan. Honest difference of viewpoints and Kethan was within his rights to then say he was going to leave. But ML was also within his rights to decline to accept Kethan's demands as not in the best interests of the team. It's hard to argue with that given that in what would have been Kethan's senior year, GW won 28 games and an NIT Championship. It would be another thing if we went 16-15 that year.
All of that is a far cry from bracketing that disagreement with the current ML controversy. And that really is my beef here. Both parties were big boys and moved on at the time. Perhaps we should take a cue from them and move on from using every possible instance of a transfer as a referendum on the investigation and its determination. Somethings are simply not related to any material degree and this is one of them. We would have had transfers with or without any allegation of misconduct by ML. That's where we are now in college basketball.
The larger point is that if you want to bash ML for his conduct that is one thing and there are still many questions to be answered as to the specifics underlying the conclusion that was reached. But all that needs to be separated from his coaching ability which was demonstrably and historically damn good at GW. To me, this was just a player-coach disagreement regarding proper role. And that falls under the coaching heading.
the mv3/20/2017 1:25:16 PM
And, well, no, I don't think that such a theory has merit, and I don't think that Bigfan feels that way either. What we would like to know is the truth as to whether the theory does have any merit. And in case there's any confusion, some jackass masquerading as an anonymous board regular telling me that there's no truth to it isn't exactly the definitive proof I am seeeking.
ruserious3/20/2017 1:38:20 PM
GYHP speaks the truth. But whenever anyone posts truthfully about what happened the same posters say over and over again they "need proof". Why do you think ML hasn't filed a lawsuit? Everything he has said/done would be made public. Why no settlement? Because GW has way too much on ML and ML has nothing on GW. It's not rocket science.
mentzinger3/20/2017 1:54:22 PM
Maine Colonial has absolutely no idea what transpired with ML, any more than any of the rest of us do. It's becoming pretty clear that, as a representative of the Alumni Association, Maine Colonial may have been prompted to post things here that are embarrassing to ML, whether they are true or not. If that is the case, I am very saddened by this. If it is not the case, one wonders why he consistently uses any topic -- including transfers, which have a multitude of causes -- for his numerous anti-ML posts. Literally everything he posts about (unless it's "famous GW alumni of 19th century lithography) has to do with how ML is a vile subhuman being who undoubtedly did what he was accused of and deserves what he got.
It might be true. But he doesn't know that yet. No one does.
Bo Knows (and MV and others) are essentially correct in that players such as Kethan and others transfer for a myriad of reasons, and they are doing it with greater frequency. Character issues, playing time, differences in philosophy, positioning, false promises on the recruiting trail, being recruited over, wanting to be closer to momma, and just plain underperformance are all possibilities.
Similarly, coaches and their ADs part ways for all sorts of reasons. None of us knows, but why would Brad Underwood leave Oklahoma State after one very successful season for a lateral move to Illinois? There will be rumors and such (and because they are public schools, more facts might be discoverable), but the underlying issue is sometimes talented people cannot get along, and so one has to leave, and it's usually not the boss. But it looks weird and mells funny and in the absence of facts (including in the Post piece), a lot of rumor gets turned into fact. I think we are all well aware of the "fake news" syndrome that's disrupting society.
The current narrative is that ML had some kind of tidal wave of transfers under his tenure, but this is simply not the case. You can look at the transfer rate nationally or at any particular program and see that kids are transfering because they are told they can play more elsewhere and because NCAA rules have made it easier. Also, plenty of players have transferred IN, so while it's not net-net, it does suggest that recruiting is all about fit.
Which leaves the narratives of the allegedly derided players ... reportedly, that they came from "welfare homes," need to play in a "trans league," and were playing for an AD who had various forms of improper contact with them. Did he say these things? To whom? Can it be verified, other than an anonymously sourced story in the Post? Was there any context around those statements? Can it be ascribed to the rough and tumble process of training athletes to compete (put another way, do you think Gerry Gimelstob may have said some things to players that even would make ML blush?)? Which of those player statements is true? Which are provably true? Were the statements notarized? We've gone into this already at great length. But the questions do remain.
So we currently have as the basis for ML's firing: 1) a Post story with exactly zero on-the-record sources, 2) a university investigation the details of which we don't yet know (and by "yet," I think we will, and that this may be the biggest sticking point currently in the legal proceedings between ML and GW.)
(Yes, there are legal proceedings).
So, what I would like is that, however long it takes to get to the real truth about why ML was fired, people refrain from making statements that are going to earn Herve a subpoena from ML's lawyer, and perhaps some posters a subpoena to testify in court about who it is they are "working for" when they post character-damaging information about what they *think* ML did.
The chances are pretty good that we will learn a lot more about what went on with ML's ouster than has yet been reported. The problem is that those disclosures are part of the legal mix being negotiated regarding ML's lawsuit against the university. I have a pretty good sense of what ML's legal strategy is going to be. I won't guess as to the outcome, but I do know that the wheels are still turning on this.
Short version: No one here knows enough about what went down with ML to be posting anonymously about what a lousy guy he is. Don't invite trouble. Just be patient.
gyph3/20/2017 2:51:16 PM
Mentz, you're disgusting. The Alumni Association doesn't even pay attention to the basketball team. What a crock.
Lonergan has been prompting people to post here, and on twitter, and messaging fans of the program -- sounds to me like you've certainly gotten the Happy Birthday/the truth will out! -- messages from him, and probably texts and god knows what else.
I have plenty of my own information about how unhinged he was. I attend events and games. I have ears and eyes. I had my own suspicions long before the Post article. The sources are on the record to the Post. They're not on the record to you.
I watched Lonergan build this weirdo cult of personality with you people and say all the right things that desperate old fans like yourself and thought, hmmm. When the team stopped winning the hmmmm turned into a WTF is happening here. I didn't need to be part of Rice Hall to question it.
The whole slew of you that are of a certain age just hate the University.
The worst rumor of them all, the one that elevated this from garden-variety abusive coach gets caught, University forced to act publicly into the stratosphere, is the one propagated by Lonergan as a defense. Talk about no evidence. Talk about fake news. He went on the Sports Junkies and allowed the Penn State anology to be made.
And still you all defend him and say there's more to the story. Well, he doesn't act like it. I know his attorneys certainly have not been telling him to conduct public campaigns on twitter and facebook and send out his acolytes and his family members and old friends into it, either. More so than anything, it's his behavior after the Post article that convinced me of the fact that he's unfit to serve as a leader.
mentzinger3/20/2017 3:17:41 PM
GYPH (or GYHP ... or whatever other eponyms he's been using these past few months) makes one verifiable statement in his rant, that "the Alumni Association doesn't even pay attention to the basketball team."
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gyph3/20/2017 3:42:06 PM
Do you seriously think the Alumni Association does anything but the gamewatch and the happy hour? Have you ever attempted to plan an alumni event around the basketball team? Do you know as well as I do that the return email address on that email is for someone that doesn't work for the alumni association but instead someone who works for athletics?
the mv3/20/2017 3:42:56 PM
Now Lonergan "allowed" the Penn State analogy to be made? GYPH is a frighteningly complete source of misinformation.
The Penn State analogy was nothing more than one of the Junkies, in a discussion with the other Junkies, muttering Penn state under his breath and immediately regretting the utterance the moment it left his mouth. None of the other Junkies mentiooned it in the slightest. It was forgotten the moment after it was mistakenly reference. And, it took place not with Lonergan on the phone but either during or immediately after a conversation with John Feinstein.
But somehow, Lonergan allowed it? What a fool you are GYPH. And considering who you really are, a creep too.
ruserious3/20/2017 4:31:25 PM
I'm stunned that someone wouldn't know that the GW athletic marketing dept is behind the alumni events that are planned around games.
gw693/20/2017 4:32:48 PM
Depressing thread.Not much to talk about I suppose other than CBI.
Same old crap recycled.
bigfan3/20/2017 6:58:36 PM
While the know-it-all, despite providing evidence of nothing, attitude of GYPH, is annoying on a good day, it is really crossing the line with allegations in this thread--and in others.
In this McCarthyesque spewing of allegations, just because we don't swallow whole the unproven tale of the abusive, gay-bashing and now throwing in racist tale of a coach who was successful for more than 20 years and accept at face value that we should have a 31 year-old third assistant as head coach, you feel we are "insane," "paranoid" and now "disgusting."
MV addressed it, but will say it for the umpteenth time--and not revealing something, but putting into context what was reported on GW hoops. Much like the lack of context, Mentzinger noted, in the article or anything we have heard from official sosurces, there is a lack of context on the Lonergan comments.
If you accept the Nero jerking off over practice tapes comments (the kind of sarcastic comment that has been made here, for example, before), maybe need to understand the context. Nero clearly had private contact with at least Kevin Larsen. That private contact was said to be outside the office. Said to be private dinners. Also said by some people seemingly not to be anything sinister or secretive(if we even have to bring this up).
This is not a secret within the program. Pretty much everyone knows it. You probably do, too. Yet, you won't acknowledge it.
One can imagine how a coach would react to this contact with their boss. Also, one can imagine it may be miscontrued under NCAA rules, even if quite innocent.
Posters here have said that Lonergan made an official complaint. Looks like everything went downhill from here. Darnell not coming here may be collateral damage of the struggle between the AD and the coach. Struggles between an AD and a coach are not that unusal. See Williams and Yow.
By not acknowledging the other side of the story which is impossible to miss when anyone would be seriously looking at this in an article or an investigation, is to participate in a cover up over contex at the very least. If one accepts, and not disputing it, that Lonergan made that remark, one might ask why. Didn't come out of the blue.
The longtime posters you disparage have never suggested anything more.
The fact that the other side of the story is not relayed at all in the hatchet job article or anywhere else outside of here, is what concerns us.
A successful coach who turned down an offer three times his salary to remain loyal, was escorted out of his office and off campus by security. Everything but leg irons. And then cut out of the NIT championship video in revisionist history. Some of us old fogeys find that--and the subsequent chain of events--hard to accept without an explanation.
Don't know if you are a recent graduate or a millennial, but you certainly act like a recent college graduate, cutting your teeth in an atmosphere where free speech and two sides of the story are horrible and unacceptable. Many of us older farts went to college to learn both sides of the story and have friends and acquaintances of different political, ethnic, and social stripes.
You've accused a vast majority of the board several times as being stupid old people, because we won't blindly accept your argument. That may work in your bubble, but it doesn't here or in any sane society.
So, while it would be a microagression in your milieu, GYPH and others who support these nonsensical accusations on a basketball bulletin board, grow up and be a man, or a woman, or whatever you want to be.
As long as in these discussions, you act like an adult.
ruserious3/20/2017 7:11:28 PM
Again, those who say they wish someone would post the truth, have a complete meltdown when someone actually does post (a very small part of) the truth. Someday maybe you will be able to read the invesetigation report, Bigfan (although, unfortunately I doubt it). But I honestly wonder if you could handle it.
maine colonial3/20/2017 7:21:26 PM
Total transfers leaving schools in the last 4 years:
Saint Joseph's: 2
La Salle: 4
Wichita State: 5
George Mason: 7
Rhode Island: 7
St. Bonaventure: 7
Saint Louis: 10
the other mg3/20/2017 7:40:10 PM
Anyway, although I have UNC in both of my pools, I would be happy if Butler took them down, and if Kethan had a lot to do with it.
I'm just a simple fan, hoping that our team does well, and hoping that the transfers do well at their new schools, too. I just enjoy hearing our school mentioned, especially in late rounds of tournaments (even the CBI).
I also know nothing about what happened with Coach Lonergan, and therefore think it's wrong to even voice my opinion. I'm just watching this ping pong game, and am getting real tired of it.
220.127.116.11/20/2017 8:30:37 PM
12 transfers out in 4 years.
2015-16: Swan, Cimino, Jorgensen out; Mitola, Cavanaugh in (net -1)
2014-15: Savage, Griffin, Bryant out (net -3)
2013-14: Cartagena, Maragkos, Skyler White out; Creek in (net -2)
2012-13: Davis, Kromah, Pellom out (net -3)
Should we count Malik Tonkins in 2011 as well? How about Roy Ghantous? Michael Conward? Maybe these guys were walk-ons. Not sure.
Mitola basically won the NIT with that buzzer shot to beat Hofstra, Creek was an all-conference-type performer who buried the Terps in the BBT, Cavanaugh is a walking double-double and one the Top 20 players ever to don the Buff and Blue.
Except Savage and Jorgs, I like the net talent gain in the transfer carousel under ML. Pretty typical arc for a team with a new head coach. Not sure I understand how this is an indictment of anything but recruiting misses.
mentzinger3/20/2017 8:34:56 PM
Oops, forgot Armwood, as well. Terrible transfer. Horrible step-in for Maragkos.
gyph3/20/2017 8:41:15 PM
Who the hell are you to tell anyone how to behave about anything? You have no idea who I am, or how old I am, or what I do for a living. The mentality on this board has been, for the, FYI, over a decade that I've read it, that longetivity and loudness somehow explains, excuses, and approves all of your terrible behavior. And it's not only ever just aimed at the University -- I wisely wouldn't read it or post in undergrad (AT A TIME OF UNPRECEDENTED SUCCESS) because I was horrified about what you said about my classmates.
Unbelievable to me you yet again brought a player's name into this. Everything else read exactly like I know Lonergan's friends have been parroting, so I'm not surprised.
"turned down an offer three times his salary." Yeah, Rutgers. Count their lucky stars everyday, and no one thought he would take it, not because he was "loyal", but because he made it totally clear he was never leaving the DMV again.
It says a lot about both you and Lonergan that your defense to the jerk off comment is naming a player it was in relation to and not denying he said it. I wonder how Kevin felt about it. He's a person, after all, not a pawn. A person whose coach was talking like that about him.
As the kids would say, SMDH.
maine colonial3/21/2017 6:45:50 PM
I had to have my daughter translate SMDH. I'm not going to dive back into this debate for fear of Herve and his giant...LINK
luvdagame3/22/2017 1:04:43 AM
Congrats to Kethan!!! My children and I have followed him all season and probably caught almost all televised Butler games even when Kethan wasn't playing. On another note, beat UNC? The Other MG, I am not quite there yet!!! Been a fan since the early 80s and I own too much paraphernalia to concede now but I do wish Kethan the best of luck!!!